For many in LuLaRoe, building their business became their entire life. Their work. Their community. And their sense of self worth. After leaving, it can feel like starting from scratch again.
For many in LuLaRoe, building their business became their entire life. Their work. Their community. And their sense of self worth. After leaving, it can feel like starting from scratch again. We’ll hear from former retailer Lynzee Abel about her journey to build her life back post-LuLaRoe, and how she found stability in a new job. And we’ll check back in with former retailer Heidi Castellani, whose story you heard in Episode One.
Want more of the LuLaRoe story? Stream "The Rise and Fall of LuLaRoe" documentary on discovery plus. Go to discoveryplus.com/lularoe to start your 7-day free trial today. Terms Apply.
Find episode transcript here: https://the-rise-and-fall-of-lularoe.simplecast.com/episodes/ep6-life-after-lula
Episode 6: Life After LuLaRoe
THEME IN
Intro
Stephanie: Hi everyone! This is The Rise and Fall of LulaRoe. I’m your host, Stephanie McNeal and I’m a senior culture reporter at Buzzfeed News. In this podcast we are diving deep into the world of LulaRoe - we speak with retailers whose lives were turned upside down. We also talk to experts who can shed light on how these MLMs really work...including the red flags you should keep an eye out for.
This week, I’m talking to former consultant Lynzee Abel about how she built her life back after leaving LulaRoe. For many former consultants, starting over from scratch can be difficult after giving so much of their time, money - and even their sense of identity - to LulaRoe.
We’ll hear from Lynzee about what it was like re-entering the workforce, and what she learned from her time in LulaRoe. We’ll also hear more from former consultant Heidi Castellani, whose story you heard in Episode 1.
Let’s get into it.
THEME OUT
Stephanie [00:00:38] // Hi, Lynzee. Thank you so much for joining us.
Lynzee: Thank you for having me
Stephanie [00:00:55]I am so looking forward to hearing more about how you build your life back after leaving LuLaRoe, but to hear about how you built your life back, of course at first. Now we're going to have to hear how you got into a LuLaRoe in the first place. So what was your LuLaRoe journey? How did you get started in LuLaRoe?
Lynzee [00:01:17]So pretty much like everybody else, I got a random Facebook invitation from a girl I barely knew come to this party. She was selling LuLaRoe and I had just had a baby. My son was just a couple of months old. So of course, typical mom. I have no clothes that fit me. I feel very uncomfortable in my body. And so I start looking around // and eventually they talked me into having a party. I had a party. They were selling stuff like crazy. I got all this free stuff. I had another friend, Katie, who I had invited to the party. She texted me, What is this stuff? How did you hear about it? Look at all this stuff they're selling. Are they making any money? And we start talking about it. And she said, we should do this. Why aren't we doing this? Look at all the money they're making. We should do this. So cut to I think it was March is when we finally got started of 2016. // we were part of the group that really got in. You know, I won't say the top of the pyramid, but at a good spot in the pyramid to really see that boom of the rise of the business. And we built a team. We ended up being trainers. We went to a trainer training in California. //And then, you know, much like everybody else, we started to get these boxes of clothes that were unsellable. And from there, as we saw that decline, we ended up stepping out and I think we finally quit. It was like December 2018 is when we finally bid our final farewell. //
Stephanie [00:07:50] // did you have a breaking point
Lynzee [00:12:45]I think I had kind of a mental breaking point. And when all of this started happening and then my friend Katie kind of came to me and she said, I don't think I can do this anymore. It's too much. // and the panic started to set in. // And when she announced that she was leaving // I said, I don't think I'm going to stick around either. This is a lot of work and I've taken on a lot. We're not getting the product that we need to even sell. Nothing's ever available. What we do get is garbage, and I used to be excited to rush to ups every morning and get my boxes. And now it's more of a chore because who knows what's even going to be in there and if I'm even going to be able to do anything with it? //I just it's really hard //You have so much time and energy and money invested in it. And I still need to do something and I don't want to go back to work. So I've got to make this work. And it took me a few weeks to really process it all and think I can't make this work anymore. //
Stephanie [00:15:33]How did you make the big announcement you were leaving? Do you remember hitting published on that Facebook post or how did you do it?
Lynzee [00:15:41]Yeah, we posted a big post about we've had so much fun with all of you. We appreciate everybody that has been a great customer of ours, but it's our time to step away and we're having a big sale. And that was basically it. //
Stephanie [00:16:59] What was it like in that moment to finally be done? did you feel a palpable sense of relief or sadness?
Lynzee [00:17:08] // it was definitely a relief to just be. This is official. It's done, it's over. We got to get rid of this stuff and move on with our lives.
Stephanie [00:17:41] // did you have any other emotions going through your head or what was it like to go from luLaRoe is such a big part of my life to completely out of the fold.
Lynzee [00:17:58] It was really stressful because, again, my debate was what is my next step with my life? Do I go back to school? I had already started my master's degree. I kind of put it on hold because I had my son. I was busy with real estate, busy with LuLaRoe. At one point I was doing all those things, plus taking care of my kids. And so I said, I need a break. I'll finish school later. And I felt this guilt of, I still need to make money. What am I going to do? So there was that stress //And my whole life at that point was LuLaRoe. I only talked to LuLaRoe people. I only surrounding myself with LuLaRoe people. I only did things with other LuLaRoe people. And then it's like all of a sudden they're done with you. //
Stephanie [00:20:46] That sounds like it could be really confusing and damaging to your psyche that all of these people who I had again, like standing dates with play dates. I mean, these are people you knew in real life too, right? Not just on the internet. To realize that friendship was that tenuous, that sounds really difficult.
Lynzee [00:21:07] it was really hard, I cried, and I said, I feel like I'm leaving LuLaRoe and I'm losing all my friends //it really was a really lonely, lonely feeling. And maybe that hit me harder because I was, you know, I did have two young kids. I didn't really get out a whole lot anyway. I didn't really have a lot of people that I corresponded with a lot. So then suddenly it's like, I have this whole group who I thought were friends and then gone. // back to nobody, I guess // It was really strange //
Stephanie [00:23:14] // So you're in this stage where you don't know what to do next. Financially, you've lost a big support system and your friend group. What was the biggest challenge you feel like you're facing at that time?
Lynzee [00:23:30] I'm a planner by nature, so just trying to figure out my next steps was really, really hard. // I actually did move on to another MLM shortly after. I don't know if you've ever heard of it, but DeAnne's sister Dianne actually had honey and lace, which became Piphani.
Stephanie: And just for our listeners that’s deanne stidham, founder of LulaRoe
Lynzee: right. // I did that very briefly until I really put the pieces together that what they were doing was a lot of their product. They were buying from wholesale companies, marking up and reselling to consultants for a consultant to then mark up and resell. They were not manufacturing all of their own products, even though they really portrayed it that way. //
Stephanie [00:33:57] I feel like people might be surprised to hear that you would join another MLM right after doing LuLaRoe. Do you feel like it was just easier because you were at this point used to the business model and you already had the built-in Facebook group // Or what was your thought process at the time?
Lynzee [00:34:17]One hundred percent. I already have the group. I already have the access. It's easy to get started and also a little bit of it can't be as bad as LuLaRoe, right? Lula was a disaster. It can't be as bad as them. // This one's not going to be the rumors // and the drama, and I'm not going to do it the same way. I'm not going to build this team. I'm not going to go through all of that. This one is going to be completely different. And I learned rather quickly that it was just the same old thing with a different name. //
Stephanie [00:35:27]Did you swear off MLMs for good after that? Or what was your thought process at that point?
Lynzee [00:35:32] // looking back on it and seeing how bad it was and then putting the pieces together of all of these multilevel marketing companies are doing these same things. And I did start researching and listening to a lot of podcasts and putting my own pieces together of kind of where we are. And that's when I really started with my I am Anti MLM completely. I am MLM free. I don't buy the products I’m not going to support them. I'm sorry that you're your boss, babe, who wants to sell me whatever, but I don't buy those types of products. Those are not for me. Sorry, not going to the party. I'm not participating in any of it anymore. /
Stephanie [00:37:21] // So I assume after you got out of LuLaRoe // eventually, you started looking for a job in the corporate world again. That must've been a big transition, going from something like LuLaRoe, which is so different than your typical job in so many ways. What was that like for you and how did you kind of try to get back to the more traditional workforce?
Lynzee [00:37:54] // the job that I had prior to real estate // I worked there for like seven years. So it's been a long time since I've had a full on job hunt. So it's very different looking for a job in 2021 than it was looking for a job in, like 2007 or whatever the last time I had to really look for a job. // And on top of that, I felt the need to kind of explain // OK, I worked at this place until 2014. And then what you know // I didn't know how to handle that. That job gap, so I stuck with I decided to stay home with my children // I felt very embarrassed to say, Oh, I sold clothes for LuLaRoe for a little over two years, // I don't want people to form an opinion ahead of time about that, I guess. And so that was really challenging. //
Stephanie [00:42:12] Can you expand a little bit more on that decision to not talk about LulaRoe on your resume?
Lynzee [00:42:37]I guess I just didn't want somebody to see this girl was involved in one of these MLM companies, even if they didn't know what LuLaRoe is. I didn't even want to have to explain to them, Oh, I sold clothes from my house because my thought process was, Do people really even consider that a real job? I feel like if I was on the other end, maybe I would have some questions about that, and I just felt like I didn't want to have to explain all of that. //especially with all the media attention that LuLaRoe started to get that I feel like people who weren't necessarily aware of it before suddenly became aware of it. And I just didn't want that negative impact to fall on me when I worked really hard and didn't contribute in any way to that. //
Stephanie [00:44:10]That's such a bummer because, like you said, nothing that happened to LuLaRoe and the fact that everyone's talking about LuLaRoe in this way, was your fault. // that's a hidden impact almost of the LuLaRoe saga now you have this huge gap of your resumé that you have to explain away on top of everything else.
Lynzee [00:44:45] Right, 100 percent. //
Stephanie [00:47:47] //So what is it you're doing now? And how do you compare this career to your LuLaRoe career in terms of normality of a job?
Lynzee [00:47:59] So I'm a production coordinator for a manufacturing facility actually really close to where I live. So with LulaRoe, you're driving all over the place for parties and you got to hustle for that money. But I drive seven minutes to and from work every day, which is amazing, //It's a very small company, so I kind of just jack of all trades there. //So it's really nice to not have that stress of the whole world kind of depends on you, like when you sell something like LulaRoe. if you aren't. Doing it all the time, you're not making money, right? Where I'm making money from eight to 4:30. And if I have to take a day off for a doctor's appointment, I'm still making money while I'm at the doctor. // it's such a relief. I guess it's really a relief to just have a simple job, and it kind of blows my mind that these women still really have an appreciation for this life of the hustle to make their money because I just keep thinking it's so much easier to just go to a job and be done at 4:30. //
Stephanie [00:51:07] It's really ironic because the whole sell of a lot of these MLMs is that you're going to have such a better lif e than if you work in corporate America, but a lot of times I feel like. It ends up being really different and a lot more difficult than I think people imagine. // I've talked to a lot of former consultants over the years who have had a chance to kind of sit back and unpack their LulaRoe experience, and since you've been out for a few years and you now have all these new perspectives. Are there any things you've come to terms with about your time there or realizations you've had //
Lynzee [00:51:52]I think one of the biggest realizations is // I was in a really vulnerable place at the time. You know, I just had my son. I had very bad postpartum depression when I had him. Life was crazy and hectic with two kids and work and finishing school and everything that was going on. Our house was under like we had. We bought an old farmhouse. We had our whole upstairs of our house gutted. So we were only living in our downstairs and just the chaos of life was really stressful. And when something comes to you that you feel like is going to save you. I don't think it matters who you are or what type of person you are if you're in that vulnerable state. It's going to get you, and I feel like that's where I was, and I think I really have, like you said, unpacked it and learned I have to stop and really think about things a little more instead of, I kind of acted a little more impulsively than probably what I normally would because I am naturally a skeptic. I question everything. And it was just something about it that captured me, and we should have paid more attention to some of those red flags. instead of kind of jumping all in
Stephanie [00:53:49] how have you worked through the emotions of forgiving yourself for jumping in to something? I think especially as someone who is naturally a little hesitant and skeptical. It's sad that you did take this leap of faith and it ended up so poorly. So do you feel like there were self-help things you read?Did you rely on friends, family, therapy? How did you kind of get past this experience?
Lynzee [00:54:19] // I think what has really kind of helped me is platforms like this, the the podcast, the documentaries, all of those types of things to realize. I'm not the only person, even though sometimes, you know, even look, I have this sitting on my desk, so I had to take a hammer to it that says hashtag hustle. What a loser that I bought at Marshalls that I paid six ninety nine for this dumb thing. You know, I'm not the only one that went through all of that, and other people shared those same experiences. //it really helps me kind of get rid of some of that shame I feel on myself. I'm still embarrassed that I did it, but it's good to know you're not alone when you do stupid things I guess.
Stephanie [00:56:43] I feel like that's one really nice aspect of the LulaRoe story is how you guys have really come together in various communities and lifted each other up out of this because you guys were all working hard. // you weren't to blame for all of the issues and you were fighting an uphill battle. And I think that's one thing that's very inspirational to me // So you are someone who has made it to the other side of an MLM. //What advice would you give to someone who's either thinking about leaving LuLaRoe specifically or another MLM, but is facing the same fears that you did when you were deciding to leave?
Lynzee [00:57:26] I think as people, we are resilient and we will find a way to meet the needs, whether it's financially or community wise, emotionally. You will find a way. // And if you get even a little glimmer of maybe I shouldn't do this anymore, that means it's time to not do that anymore. And it'll be OK if you walk away because there's a whole community of us who have learned a lot of valuable lessons that are there to support you //
Stephanie [00:58:11] It has been so great to talk to you and learn from you. Lynzee, thank you so much for joining me.
Lynzee [00:58:17]Thank you for having me.
[music cue]
Stephanie: Many former LulaRoe consultants I’ve talked to struggled with some of the things Lynzee talked about - like building back their career. But others also struggled with reconnecting with their families and their own sense of self.
To wrap up the series, we’ll revisit Heidi Castellani’s story - you heard from her in our very first episode. She told us about how she left LulaRoe due to the poor organization in the company, and the emotional impact that leaving had on her.
Ad Break here
[music fade]
Heidi Castellani
Stephanie [01:14:02] // What was the impact on your family, you and your husband or you and your husband, your children, either financially or emotionally or both from the big loss of your lularoe income and inventory?
Heidi [01:14:23] So I will say that my husband is older and he's been in the world of investments for a long time, so he you know, it wasn't a huge deal to him // The thing that affects me the most that I look at is all the time that it took from my eldest son, though, when he was just a toddler. Looking back on that, you know, that's // time and energy. I'll never get back that he deserved.// as a new mom // I I didn't realize the impact initially. I really didn't. We're OK though now. But that that's really what got me for a long time and what I had to really work through was all the time I took for my son.
Stephanie [01:15:38] you said that you felt like a couple of years after you left LulaRoe that you realized you had to work through some of the emotions you had after you left. What were some of those emotions?
Heidi: many of the dynamics within Lula roe repeated the dynamics of my abusive childhood home growing up. the gaslighting, the toxic positivity. You know, when things went wrong being told. // fix it // this is you. You need to figure out a way to fix it. Figure out the workarounds, you'd be like, well, why doesn't why doesn't our our sales processing system work? And somehow LulaRoe would always find a way to spin it about us not finding a solution. It was our fault, actually. You know, the reason why you couldn't sell all of the duplicate prints, it's actually your fault. You're just you just don't know how to put outfits together in style. So maybe this isn't for you. //Those things are really, really toxic and abusive. And there was also just the fact, you know, come to find out like they were giving certain people preference and advantages. You know, so the whole time you're not one of the sellers that's getting the unicorn prints and in your mind, you're thinking, it's all, it's all your fault. You know, and come to find out they were showing preferential treatment to the people that were spending the most money anyway. That's awful, that's abusive.
Stephanie [01:18:21] it's hard to reconcile the reality versus what you are being told for sure. So after you quit LulaRoe, what were some things you did to build your life back to what you wanted it to be?
Heidi [01:18:37] I feel really fortunate that I went after I left LulaRoe. I had a newborn baby to sort of sink into. I was really fortunate because a newborn baby requires all of you, for the most part.
Stephanie [01:18:56]it's a great distraction.
Heidi [01:18:57]Yeah, it's a great full time distraction. So but you know, after my second child was a year old, that was sort of when all of the emotional stress of lularoe came back to a head for me. I started seeing a therapist and I was like, You know what? Maybe I should probably talk about the time I was involved in a cult like MLM, (laughs) // and I started to talk about it with my psychologist, and she was breaking it down, too. Like I realized what I had gone through and that it was really not just like this, you know, like an MLM experience or a bad business experience. It was much more than that.
Stephanie [01:19:53]What were some things you learned through examining this time in your life through therapy?
Heidi [01:20:00]I think that one of the things that I learned was the power of love bombing and toxic positivity. Those were things that I wasn't totally privy to prior to this.//
Stephanie [01:20:40]what were some ways you feel like LulaRoe love bombed you? And for those who don't know who haven't heard this term in therapy, what is that exactly?
Heidi [01:20:50] So love bombing is this initial rush of, you know, you meet someone // and it's this immediate rush of good feelings, good vibes and positivity and love and acceptance all at once. And it's right off the bat, right out of the gates. And that's really the difference. And when you think about it, most of your long lasting genuine connections with people have probably grown in a really organic way, much more naturally. There's no love bombing at first. You don't experiencing love bombing until much later in the relationship // and LulaRoe does an amazing job at it. There's lots of cheerleading that goes on. //
Stephanie [01:23:49] So how how do you feel like today, you know you're four years out from your LulaRoe experience? Do you feel like there's any impact it's had on your life today? And // I know that you're a stay at home mom currently thinking about reentering the workforce. Do you feel like you have interesting new perspectives on life or career or anything like that?
Heidi [01:24:17] you know, my experience with LulaRoe wasn't all negative. Like I said, I still have friendships I've maintained years later and bonds that I will probably always have with certain women. There are also things I learned about myself as far as my ability to to make things work when I'm not given the appropriate system to to do my job with, I find a work around. I wore so many different hats as a LulaRoe boutique owner. I really learned a lot about how much I'm capable of. // and even now, I think about the fact that I would like to return to work in 2022 // and then, of course, when the documentaries about LulaRoe came out in 2021, and that certainly brought back a lot of old feelings. // it's like things I didn't even realize too just new emotions surfacing now, so many years later, that's wild.
Stephanie [01:26:43] Absolutely. // In reflecting on everything you know about LulaRoe and about multilevel marketing and your experience // if you had a chance to sit down with the Stidhams in a room, what would you say to them and what would you say to women who are saying to themselves, maybe I should join this MLM.
Heidi [01:28:35]Oh, boy. So first of all, I think that my what I would first say to women in general is always go with your gut instinct, your gut is like right Ninety nine point nine percent of the time. And you know it. So when you start to see red flags. Pay attention to them and don't. Don't be afraid to accept them when you first start to see them. And also do your due diligence before you get involved. Really, really read up about MLMs. See what they're about. See how many people are making money. Look at the income disclosure statement of the company that you're considering. Make sure you do that one thing if you don't do anything else. Look at the income disclosure statement. OK? Because that's how you will see how many people are making money selling that product. //If I had to say something to the Stidhams. I think it would just be a question of when will you take ownership of your mess, when? at what point will you finally take ownership of this? //
Stephanie [01:30:54]Heidi, thank you so much for taking the time to speak with me today and sharing your story. I really appreciate it.
END CREDITS
OUTRO
Thanks so much for listening to The Rise and Fall of LulaRoe - a Discovery Plus podcast. And if you haven't already, check out the documentary streaming now on Discovery Plus.
From Discovery, our executive producer is Michael DiSalvo [Deh-Sall-vo]. From Buzzfeed, our executive producer is Karolina Waclawiak [Vahts-LAH-vee-ACK].
Special thanks to Shelley Sinha [Sin-Ha] at Discovery, Samantha Henig and Richard Alan Reid at Buzzfeed, and Pete Ross at Left/Right.
Our show is produced by Neon Hum Media. Jonathan Hirsch and Shara Morris are the executive producers. Our lead producer is Muna Danish. Associate Producer is Rufaro Faith. Our production manager is Samantha Allison. Sound design and engineering from Mark Bush. Our theme music is from Epidemic Sound.
I’m your host - Stephanie McNeal